The Road to Your Name Podcast

Samantha Doxtator
[00:00:00]
Lisa: Welcome to our next episode of Yohate Nekasana, the Road to Your Name podcast. On this episode, we're really lucky to be visited by Samantha Dobstader from the Oneida Nation and the Wolf Clan. So Samantha's come all the way from Oneida. To join us today on the podcast, and we're going to learn about what she does.
And we're going to talk about astronomy, Haudenosaunee astronomy knowledge. So welcome Samantha to the podcast today.
So let's start with just telling us a little bit about yourself and how you came to be teaching and learning and speaking about Haudenosaunee Star Stories. So[00:01:00]
Sam: I'm happy that we're here together.
Lisa: I could understand that .
Sam: Yeah. Oneida Mo. Similar. Yeah. So I can understand Mohawk words too.
Intro: Mm-Hmm. .
Sam: So you're the Oneida are the little brothers? Yeah. So our languages are similar. I'm a personal development consultant. We specialize in teaching life and employability skills that are grounded by traditional values.
I've been doing this for 11 years now. Mm hmm. And we travel around to different nations just facilitating workshops on, on different skills from communication skills to language learning to sewing and indigenous diet cooking and gardening. And so we have many different things that we teach and indigenous astronomy has always [00:02:00] been part of everything we do.
But I didn't fully take on this gift of, of staying and researching this information until last year. So, my younger sister, her name is, was Sasha Dockstader, and this is her research. She was returning to school, to university, as an adult, and she was in a First Nations studies program, and one of her teachers, uh, She needed like an elective and so one of her professors or no, one of her, I think the people that help you choose your courses, a counselor.
Yeah. They asked her, what about astronomy? And she's like, yeah, I think I, I'd be interested in that. So she, she took the astronomy course and. Her professor in that course told her there's another professor and [00:03:00] he's looking to work with an Indigenous student to do research on Indigenous astronomy research.
So Sash, you know, that ignited something in her and so she applied for the position and she got it. And so she worked with a professor, he's a non Indigenous student. professor, but he's really respectful with the knowledge we share with him. He's really kind and he's really respectful. Sash did research for about three years and she traveled around to different nations and different Haudenosaunee communities.
And she just gathered information and then she put that information together. And when she first took, when she first started her research, she went to the clan mothers in Oneida and she let them know what she was doing. So they were in full support of her. And when she gathered her research and when she put it all together to present it, she took it back to the clan mothers first, before she took it to the [00:04:00] university.
Intro: And
Sam: so they were in full support of her work. Thank you very much. And so Sasha, she passed away in July of 2021, two years ago, she had cancer
Intro: and
Sam: it just, it came fast and it took her quickly. It became inoperable and incurable. And so before Sasha passed, she gave me all her work and she gave me all her research and.
I said, What do you want me to do with it? And
Intro: she said,
Sam: It's yours now. You can do with it what you want. And Sash always wanted us to teach this workshop together. Yeah. Where she would do the parts she knew best, I would do the parts that I knew best, and even when she was still alive, she tried to give me this workshop, and she'd be like, Go do this presentation for me.
I'm like, I can't make it to this one. And I was like, no way, I'm not doing it without you. And she was like, you can do it. [00:05:00] So, I remember shortly after she passed away, I remember someone saying, I hope somebody in Sasha's family will continue her work.
Intro: And at
Sam: that time, I thought, there's no way I can do this without her.
And so it took me about a year until I was ready to look at her work. So it was probably about 10 or 11 months. And so I start going through her computer and I start looking through her research and she had it all laid out. She had the PowerPoint presentations already done and then she also taught this as a course at Polytech here in Six Nations.
Yeah. So they have recordings of Sash doing the actual presentation and they sent those all to me.
Lisa: Oh,
Sam: nice. So I went to the recordings, I went through her research, [00:06:00] and I thought, I can still do this. Yeah. And so when I accepted that gift of continuing her work, Sash just laid out everything in front of me, and she continues to do that.
In the past year I have all these theories, and I have all this knowledge, and All of these things just come across my path to keep sharing her work. And shortly after Sash passed away, I got sick. I got really sick. I got COVID. And my COVID turned into double pneumonia COVID. And I was put into a medically induced coma.
And the doctors told my family I was going to die. But they didn't know who they were messing with. Then when I say that, I don't mean myself.
Intro: I
Sam: mean my sister. You know, she was my protector. She always watched out for me. When I was in a coma, Sash came [00:07:00] and got me. And she took me to that middle plane.
There's a, there's this middle plane where we cross through when we're coming from Skyworld, when we're being born. When we pass away, we go through that plane. When we go back to Skyworld. That middle plane, it's connected to dream world, it's connected to star world, it's connected to water world, it's connected to sky world, and it's connected to earth world.
And in that place, there's no sense of time or location. Everybody there is busy, but it's also like paradise. And so when I was there, I thought that my gift was that I brought my sister back to life. Because she was there with me the whole entire time. So I was, I remember thinking like, How am I going to explain this to people?
They're not going to [00:08:00] understand. I don't even know if I want this gift. This isn't a gift that's normal. And I don't know how people will take it. And so I remember thinking like, How am I going to explain it? Fast forward and I don't have that gift. To bring my sister back to life, but I have accepted the gift to continue her work
Intro: so that
Sam: it's not forgotten.
And I do this work because I know she's still helping me. Yeah. And she's still sending me information and she'll come in my dreams and she'll be like, buy this book. And she knows I don't read a lot of books, but I'll buy the book and I'll be like, Oh yeah, there's some information there that I could use.
I've added so much more to her presentation, but it's because she sent me that information. Sasha's goal was really, she wanted to infuse indigenous knowledge. into every single [00:09:00] education level, from kindergarten to PhD programs. And so, if I can do my little part in continuing that work, so that she's remembered, even though when she passed away, I couldn't think of the thought of doing this work without her.
Now I can't imagine not doing this work for her.
Intro: Yeah.
Sam: My intentions now on sharing this work is to heal Indigenous oppression with astronomical knowledge and original ways of knowing. Because I want our people to remember how special we are, how smart we are, how creative we are, how innovative we are.
When you really think about it, we were so many things. We were scientists and astronomers and biodiverse farmers. We invented things. We were innovators. [00:10:00] We were doctors and lawmakers and teachers before the institutions ever existed.
Lisa: Yeah.
Sam: So I include all of those things into the presentation because that's my intention is to help our people remember how special we are and how smart we are
Intro: and
Sam: the stars, they just help to bring that connection.
Yeah, bring it all together.
Lisa: And we've always been really had a strong connection to the sky world, to the star world. And it's interesting because in our homelands, when we all looked up at the sky, we saw it from different angles, right? And, but it was all the same thing. It was the star world. What do you think is one of the main things that The, the star world has taught us,
Sam: there's a lot.
Yeah, there's lots, but you know, the, the stars [00:11:00] teach us that we're never alone. Yeah. And when our loved ones pass away, they don't disappear. They just turn into the star world. And they're always here with us. They still help us. They still connect us. And even with the, the birth and death of a star, it's real special.
Yeah. And when a star dies. They call it a supernova when it runs out of fuel and it explodes, and they call it a supernova. So when our people pass away, that ceremony of death is really a special thing that we don't talk about as much as we should. And when our people, our loved ones pass away, they become a supernova.
Just like when a star passes away and the actual star dust from that supernova is the iron that makes our blood red. Yeah. So we have [00:12:00] star dust flowing within our veins. Yeah. That's our connection and we're related. That makes us related.
Lisa: Yeah. To the
Sam: stars.
Lisa: Yeah, and that's scientific. Yeah,
Sam: science is catching up to us a little bit.
They're gaining knowledge with all of their technology, but you know we had, you know, ancestral technology. We created so many technologies that are still being used today. And all of the scientific knowledge, it's catching up a little bit to us, but this is our way of life.
Lisa: Yeah, for sure. So can you, can you share with us a star story?
Sam: Yeah, there's many different little stories and understandings, but I guess the main stories is like the Big Dipper story. And somebody asked me once, they're like, what's your favorite [00:13:00] constellation? And I was like, I don't know, do I have to choose? But I thought it's the Big Dipper because it's so reliable.
Lisa: Yeah.
Sam: I can always find it. You see it at all times of the year. And it guides us into so many things. And the story of the Big Dipper is that A long time ago, there was, there was a big bear or they heard there was a big bear in the woods and in the communities, they could hear this bear and it was taking all of the, it was like killing all the deer and everything that we were hunting for food.
Yeah. So in the communities there started to become like really hungry because the meat racks were empty. And so the, these men, these warriors, they went out to start hunting that big bear. [00:14:00] They tried for a long time to hunt that big bear and many warriors were lost and Many arrows were lost, and the arrows just barely pierced the skin of that bear.
And it just so happened that there were three warriors, and they had the same dream for three nights, that they were going to kill that big bear. And so they set out, and they went hunting that bear, and they hunted it for a long time. And then one day that bear, it jumped off the earth, and it went into the sky.
And those warriors, they went right behind them, and they followed him. And so the Big Dipper, when you see it, the scoop, that's the bear, and then the handle is the three warriors that's chasing him. But how, depending on how the Big Dipper is in the sky, it tells us what season it is. It tells us what time of year it is, that's one of our main calendars, and our clocks, and so [00:15:00] we know that it's fall, and that happened in the fall time, because the bear, when the arrows, when the warriors from the arrows, they shot the bear, and the blood came from the bear, he didn't die, but he turned the color of the trees red and yellow in the fall.
Mm hmm, so that's one of the Big Dippers. It's in a lot of our guiding ways.
Lisa: Yeah.
Sam: And it's, it is reliable. Yeah. So it is, it's easy to find and so I've only been really, the stars have always been part of our lives. I've actually only been really doing this research for the past year and there's so many more connections, like with the planets and a shooting star.
That's another story. Yeah. It's my theory, but it makes sense to me. Because they tell us that [00:16:00] when our loved ones pass away, that there comes a time when they start to send their gifts back. They send their knowledge back. They send all their goodness back. And so I was laying there one night, and I was like, when does this happen?
When do they start sending those things back?
Intro: And
Sam: this voice just came in my head, and it was like in a shooting star. And so I start researching, what is a shooting star actually? And so a shooting star isn't even a shooting star. It's a meteor, and a meteor is a rock. And so when that rock comes across the sky, the energy of it is what lights up into what we think is a shooting star.
And a meteor, when it comes from sky world to earth world, and usually it breaks up into little pieces and doesn't even make it to earth. But if it crosses that threshold and it [00:17:00] makes it, And it stays intact, it becomes a meteorite, and then a meteoroid. And a few years ago, scientists found DNA in a meteoroid, or meteorite, that made it to Earth.
So this is my theory. I share it because it makes sense to me, and makes my heart feel good. This is my theory that our family in Skyworld, they know when we're missing them. They know when we miss those things about them. And so they can see that and so in Skyworld, they get ready and they start packing up all those gifts into that rock.
And they say, I'm going to send this to my family because my family needs it. And so they pack up all their goodness into that rock and they send it across Skyworld and it lights up and it makes it to earth. Then, [00:18:00] so when there's a meteor shower. I imagine that being like, big medicine from Skyworld, because whole bunch of people, they're all getting all their gifts together, they're getting their knowledge together, they're getting all that goodness, and they're packing it up, and they're sending it back to Earthworld, because we miss it and we need it.
So when you see that shooting star, You have to be open to receiving that knowledge back and because why do we feel so lucky when we see a shooting star? Yeah, and why do we sometimes just know how to do things? Nobody ever told us nobody ever taught us but sometimes We just know how to do things because those, that knowledge and those gifts, they get sent back.
Lisa: Wow, that makes me think of something that makes me think about climate change now that we're experiencing. [00:19:00] So I hope we get a influx of meteor showers. With knowledge to tell us what we need to do. And I think humans already know what they need to do as far as taking care of the earth. Did you ever hear this?
I heard this not too long ago and it was from an anthrop, I think an anthropologist said it, but they said that the moon used to be closer to us than it is now. Did you ever hear that? No, I didn't. I didn't hear that. But long time ago, the moon was like really up
Sam: close. Anything is really possible in the universe.
Right now. It's like
Lisa: moving further and further away from us. Um, so how, how often do you like just Sit there and stare up at the sky.
Sam: As much as I can. As long as there's a clear sky. Yeah, I'm looking at the stars. Yeah, and I'm saying [00:20:00] Send me what you want me to know. I am willing and open to receive that information.
Lisa: I think the first time I heard about Star Stories, I heard about this man from the east, or from the west, Wilford Buck. He was starting to collect Star Stories for his nation, and a lot of knowledge had been lost over the years. So people now are starting, like your sister and Wilford, starting to gather it up again.
Yeah, I think I shouldn't say it was lost. It was just misplaced. Maybe. Yeah, it's always been here with us Yeah,
Sam: yeah. Yeah, those stories that they're still there. We just have to put them back together Yeah, for sure. And I know people know a little bit a little and then that's one thing with Oppression.
We always think, I don't know if I know enough to share,
Lisa: you know. [00:21:00] But we should be in the mindset of, I do know some things and I need to share them. Yeah. Yeah. I need to share what I know.
Sam: Yeah. So even just since I started sharing Sasha's work, many other people come to me and they're like, Oh, I know this, or my grandma said this, and I was like, that's awesome.
And they're like, oh, I got something for your presentation, and things like that. They'll just share with me. And so at the end of the presentation, I have a special thanks list. Anyone who tells a story or shares anything, I put them on that list. And
Lisa: I know there's, people have written books now of certain star stories.
I know there's a book out about the Gwali, Goa, the big bear story. And I've seen a book about cosmology. It's called Iroquoian Cosmology, I think there's a book out like that. So there's some knowledge in books out there, [00:22:00] but most of our knowledge still is oral tradition, isn't it? So if you want to know something, you got to be a visitor.
You got to like visiting people, making the rounds
Sam: and gathering knowledge that way. I love doing this presentation in person to people. I have done it on Zoom and I like that Zoom you can reach more people, but I do love sharing this in person.
Lisa: Yeah.
Sam: And I've, I have different theories of things and. I've told scientists and astrophysicists and scientists and science only knows so much, Sam.
We can't tell you that's not true because science only goes so far. Mm hmm. And they're like, we love your presentation. We love what you're sharing.
Lisa: And I always think about when it's scientists, like if sci, if a scientist wanted to say something, they'd have to prove it to everybody else before they'd be believed.
But that's not how [00:23:00] we, our knowledge is. We don't really have to go prove it in a courtroom or anything. Say, I believe it because that's the way our people thought. Yeah. We believed in ourselves and we believed what our ancestors taught us. Yeah. That's interesting. So, what do you think you, as you add to your presentations?
What do you think you'll ultimately do? Will you write a book about it? Will you put it all in a book or what do you plan to
Sam: do? I'm writing a kid's book right now.
Intro: Mm hmm
Sam: I wrote it. I just have to illustrate it and then whatever else net comes next. I'll self publish or I don't know I don't know where it's going.
The story is written. Oh, yeah, and then but I'm gonna do that and I like sharing this in the format I'm sharing now, but I will make a recording of it that'll be available for others to watch. Like online. Like a DVD or [00:24:00] a digital movie? Yeah. I guess a digital presentation.
Lisa: Oh yeah.
Sam: Cause it is a lot of information to absorb in a short time.
And people are like, where can I watch this again? Oh yeah. And so I am working on a digital version of the presentation so that people can go back to it and watch it again and again. And do you, you still hear from your sister periodically? Yeah. And every time I do the presentation, like I, I'll wear her earrings or I'll wear her skirt or I'll wear her shirt.
And so that I know I'm still continuing that with her and she's still helping me before we do the presentation. I'm like, Come on, sister. Let's go to work. So I know it's like part of my grief recovery. Yeah. That I can still do this with her because I have videos of her doing the presentation within the presentation.
Oh, yeah. So I'll do my part and then she [00:25:00] does a part, then I do a part, and then she does a part. So I am still able to do this presentation with her because that's what she always wanted us to do. That's
Lisa: amazing. Yeah. Good.
Sam: Thanks to technology and logistics and recordings. So
Lisa: she's still
Sam: carrying on the
Lisa: work
Sam: herself.
She's still carrying on the work.
Lisa: Well, that's great. So yeah, I'm, I've always been fascinated with the star stories and Even though We think sometimes we can think that the sky is the sky is so far away, right? It's way up there. We are so connected to this, to the sky.
Sam: Yeah.
Lisa: Yeah. It's not that far away for indigenous people.
Sam: Yeah. Yeah. Like it in measurement of miles and all of [00:26:00] those things, light years, it's far, but when we understand our energy. It's a blink away.
Lisa: What do you think about people that make their own rocket ships and they want to go to the sky? They want to go to Mars. They want to go to the moon. What do you think about that?
Sam: Oh, I have mixed feelings about those. It's almost like, don't ask questions you don't want to know the answer to. Sometimes, some things aren't meant to be explored in that way. But at the same time, it is cool to prove what we're saying is true. To have that tangible evidence of things. I use pictures from different telescopes.
And my presentation that I wouldn't have had if they didn't have that technology.
Intro: Yeah,
Sam: so I'm trying to find the balance with [00:27:00] it. Yeah, I'm trying to find the balance in my understanding of it.
Lisa: I just have the concern that I'm looking on earth. We see what human humans have done to the earth. And there's always that potential if they reach another planet.
Will that happen there too? You know, um, so those are my concerns, but yeah, knowledge is great to have and the more we know about the star world, the better off that we are for sure with our indigenous knowledge. There's a lot that you're, you're doing. What's the way that people can reach you if they want you to come to their community to do a presentation?
Sam: Most people, you can find me on Facebook at Samantha Dockstader. I'm on Instagram under Samantha Dockstader or Life of a [00:28:00] Freelancer.
Intro: Oh, yeah.
Sam: And those are pretty much the easiest route. You can also send me an email. My email is srdockstader, d o x t a t o r. at hotmail. com. But those are mostly the easiest forms of communication that I use.
Lisa: It's been great talking with you and visiting with you. And I'm looking forward to seeing your presentation soon. I can't wait to see your presentation and learn some more about. The Star World. I want to say Niawe to Samantha Dockstader for joining us on Yohate Negasuna podcast and let's meet again on the next episode.
This has been the Ohate Nega Sona, the Road to Your Name podcast series.
Intro: There are
Lisa: 10 episodes in this podcast [00:29:00] series. Let's meet again on the next episode. If you would like to learn more about our organization, Aboriginal Legal Services, and the programs and services we provide, please visit us on our website.
At our website, www.aboriginallegal.ca.
And if you feel inclined and would like to make a donation, you can click on the word Donate located at the top of the homepage of our website. You can also visit us on Facebook at Road to Your name. This has been The Yo Hotana The Road to Your Name podcast series.
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